With the apocrypha anime underway my interest in Karna has been rekindled and I realized how OP he is. She is not a true Heroic Spir… However, thi… Against Divine servants he can also do a decent job as a DPS servant, too, especially if he’s paired with Merlin and/or Waver. Just came from watching the finale of Fate Apocrypha. Karna has a barely anything, KK (which is the only reason he can step up to Gil), VS (a one shot tech that he doesn't go for), mad skillz (that won't be in range), eye beamu (gets blocked), and spear nuke (gets blocked too. You are using an out of date browser. It's good to remember wikis are only basic overviews and in no way a substitute for knowledge of the source material. Now imagine he would actually hit the armor with his sword. He also appears in E Pluribus Unum, the Fifth Singularity in Fate/Grand Order where he can also be summoned by Ritsuka Fujimaru. Let's see how the protagonists of the respective Fate series fare. I mean I always knew how op he is but I only just realized how OP he is, if that makes any sense, not sure how else to describe it. Enkidu vs Karna: I'd lean towards Karna in this 6/10 times. 28. Furthermore, upon dueling Siegfried for t… Note the sun is very important for in mythology it represented the eternity of it all, and also the aspects of all things. Fang Titan. Apocrypha last I recall list the lance as A++ while the game list it as A+. FSN Shirou Emiya vs. End of Series Sieg (untransformed, during his fight with Amakusa Shirou) UBW Shirou Emiya vs. Siegfried Sieg (during his fight with Saber of Red) Heaven's Feel Shirou Emiya vs. Siegfried/Frankenstien Sieg (during his fight with Karna) Bonus: Kinda like those debates where people ask who is stronger A or B? Location - The catacombs (mordred's hideout) Round 2 - Archer Gilgamesh vs Archer Atalanta. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. So why will you not allow me to attack him via a method that does not involve sunlight such as attacking him from his insides. We only pick the souls of 7 heros, for it is easier to access this internal holy grail with a purer form of essence. Unfortunately, Saber Lily is the only welfare Servant that costs 12 to field, yet only possesses the stats of a 3* Saber along the lines of Fergus or Bedivere. An Archive of Our Own, a project of the Organization for Transformative Works Vlad's lances piercing him from within since that's already been shown in the novel. Much like how the holy grail rests withinside the entire world, but also the grail rests within inside each and everyone one of us as humans, we have a holy grail inside of us, it may be a weaker and less powerful holy grail, but it is still there. Karna seemed to have a strong desire to fight powerful opponents. And considering that it is technically made out of light it can't be simpy destroyed. Saber: F/Z Saber had a constant source of prana. Then stop posting if you don't know, and research first. He doesn't need vasava shakti to punk saber, Stop using the wiki if you don't know what you're talking about. Gae bolgs damage is conceptual while karna's armor defends against physical and conceptual attacks provided they are external. Anime: Fate Apocrypha (Episode 3) Creator: Yuichiro Higashide - Fight: Lancer of Red (Karna) VS Ruler (Jeanne D'arc) and Saber of Black (Siegfried) You also realize that Saber never goes straight for Excaliblast right? In Fate/Extra CCC, he is summoned as Launcherin the Moon Cell Holy Grail War as the Servant of Jinako Carigiri. Lancer'sTrue Name is Karna (カルナ, Karuna? What I said: He has an excalibur rank spear (because that's what it says on the wiki), and Sun armor. Round 3 - Lancer diarmund vs Lancer Karna. Instead, his most prominent wish in his new life was to have a rematch with Saber of Blackafter their duel at the beginning of the conflict. ), Class Name Lancer(ランサー, Ransā? Why can't I say this? The chain didn't do much vs Karna in CCC so for sure it has a limit (as in the fight with Heracles too). Remember karna is half sun god (offspring of Surya), everything the light touches the armor of his protects from. She won't lose to a weakened counterpart. Well first of all we have to look at what Karna's armor actually does. Karna's armor would help him survive gae bolg as just hitting you doesn't mean instant death. Unlimited Bladeworks can be used in a similiar manner, but Archer might run out of mana before he deals enough damage. Lancer of "Red" is the Lancer-class Servant of the Red Faction in the Great Holy Grail War. Karna is good but he is not setting shit up anywhere near that extent. He doesn't NEED to use Vasavi Shakti to Punk Saber. For Fate/Extra CCC on the PSP, a GameFAQs message board topic titled "Gawain or Karna? While he is originally summoned by Feend vor Sembren of the Red Faction, he later becomes one of the Servants of Shirou Kotomine. Welcome to the forums! He can probably take a fully charged excalibur at point blank range. Limited Zero Over is a safe choice for Karna, boosting his NP and his Buster cards. And I'm damn sure there's no material that suggests as much. He is impartial to all people and, also, honors all people as "their own respective flowers". Rider (Achilles) + Lancer (Karna) vs Saber (Arthur) + Saber (Gawain) Thread starter Fang; Start date Nov 22, 2017; Status Not open for further replies. It is not a question of possibility in other words, it is a question of ease of use, better to use heros, or even fake heroes in the idea of servant classes to fill the greater grail than it is to use a single human being, or lots of human beings (such as summoning the beast 666), GRRRRRR I do not like your rules. Arthur is originally deeply plagued by his desire to save Britain to form an eternal utopia, and even while recognizing Manaka as potentially evil, he follows her commands to fulfill his wish. Rights to respective ownersEntertainment use only Location - Townsquare. Karna became famous as the rival of Arjuna, the great hero of Hindu mythology. In addition, Uncrowned Arms Mastery’s NP charge allows him to be a valuable farming Servant as well, especially in some harder farming quests where his high damage and Anti-Divine niche become valuable. Location - Forest. ), the invulnerable hero of the Indian epic Mahabharata, as a hero on the vanquished side. The only other way to beat him would probably require a couple of servants working together or exploiting his terrible luck somehow. Servants work, at least on paper like rpg characters, so every attack actually damages him but most attacks, even usually fatal ones, only scratch him. 1 Summary 2 Power of the Verse 3 Calculations 3.1 Attack Potency and Durability Calcs 3.2 Speed Calcs 3.3 Notes 4 Characters 4.1 Neutral Faction 4.2 Red Faction 4.3 Black Faction 5 Discussions The setting ofFate/Apocryphais a parallel world toFate/stay nightwhere the Greater Grailwas removed fromFuyukiafter theThird Holy Grail Warand disappeared for many years. Saber has full stats , lets say, the same as under Rin. You realize that A++ is for CCC karna who's nerfed as all hell, right? If we take this question at face value, the answer is very simple. Round 4 - Rider Iskandar vs Rider Achilles. Which is the most powerful canonically?" ), the Son of the Sun God (太陽神の子, Taiyōshin no Ko? They both clash with their Noble Phantasms, Balmung and Clarent Blood Arthur, with Saber of Red overpowering Sieg's attack, though the latter does survive.Sieg eventually returns to his normal form, but before Saber of Red can finish him, the battle is interrupted by the rampaging Berserker of Red. Karna’s Anti-Divine niche also has a lot of viable targets, allowing him to compete even in single-boss fights against Divine enemies. Karna from Apocrypha was basically living on willpower since his fight with Vlad. If it's prime Karna, then he would win by throwing Vasavi Shakti. Even if he doesn't have weapons that can bypasss his armor (though he probably has). I am done trying to reject them for now. Gil vs Enkidu: This is a tie from myth and Nasu lore. He can simply spam A-rank weapons and while they would only do minor damage, this constant barrage would probabl add up and force Karna on his knees, not to mention that Endiku would work pretty wel on Karna. No avalon for Saber. Enkidu is a complete stalemate via canon. Ultimate Defense is not the same thing as Immortality...blah blah blah even though it is not the same battle between Lancer of Red, go read the fight about Rider of Red and Saber of Black in Fate Apocryphra for example read Manga chapter 12. I see, I was assuming Gae Bolg due to the cause-effect reversing but if his armor can even prevent that well... New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the fatestaynight community. Unlike most of the Servants of Red, Karna had no specific wish for the Greater Holy Grail. This would probably hurt him a lot but not kill him. ), is the Lancer-class Servant of Kayneth El-Melloi Archibald in the Fourth Holy Grail War of Fate/Zero. Gilgamesh was designed by Nasu to be completely unbeatable; his ego being the only thing holding him back. Much like a world the sun is. even though A and B have never actually fought each other. I meant for this question to be more of a thought experiment to figure out other possibilities. There's also no way in hell, Karna was on par with Gilgamesh. Karna's greatest defence might be his greatest weakness in this match up. Gae bolgs damage is conceptual while karna's armor defends against physical and conceptual attacks provided they are external. lancelot, and saber at the end of zero held their own against gob for sometime and karna has better stats and np than both of them, though admittedly, he wasn't going for the kill in the latter i'll wager a guess that with uncrowned arms mastership, he's not getting insta ea+enkidu to the face Ah you misunderstand or maybe I just didn't phrase it properly, what I meant is that I'm wondering what other methods or noble phantasms could be effective from the currently known pool of servants. If necessary, I'd lean towards Gil winning a pyrrhic victory a la cammlan with him injured too. But nothing is perfect or invincible, everything has a flaw. If Karnas level is A++, Enkidu would be almost unbreakable. Lancer (Karna) is a character from the light novel series Fate/Apocrypha and video game series Fate/Extra CCC. Having turned into a Heroic Spirit, Siegfried looks back at his lifetime to his self as a "hero wished by others" and harbors a modest dream. Posted by u/[deleted] 4 years ago. Karna is a highly tolerant Servant who accept all matters as "that is also valid". Why can't I say vlad piercing the ultimate defense via not attacking the defense at its strongest point, but at a point the defense decides not to protect, for the armor if it protected all point would be death, there would be no flexibility, no motion, no movement, it would be not Karna's boom but instead his bane. If it was not there than it would not be possible to create a holy grail with the essence of 7 servants that can reform the entire world if the essence of the grail did not rest in each and every human being. GRRRRRR. Though perhaps your best bet might be Gawain. (2 volumes) and even there accomplish many things. Not counting ea cuz, you know...it's ea, and Vlad's lances piercing him from within since that's already been shown in the novel. 1 Fanon Wiki Ideas So Far 1.1 Possible Opponents 1.2 With Archer (Arjuna) 2 History 3 Death Battle Info 3.1 Background 3.2 Parameters 3.2.1 Fate/Apocrypha & Fate/Grand Order 3.2.2 Fate/Extra & Fate/Extella 3.3 Weapons 3.4 Skills 3.5 Noble Phantasm 3.6 Feats 3.7 Flaws Killia VS … So my main question is, given that he has what could be considered an ultimate defense, what noble phantasms do you think could penetrate or perhaps overpower said defense? Location - Multi-terrain. I excluded Vlad cuz we already know that method and it's pretty much canon, hence it would be unnecessary to mention it again. Now that I've gone over the individual match-ups, it seems as though it's in favor of F/Z. Her actual name is Artoria Pendragon, better known as King Arthur, the "Once and Future King" and a legendary hero of Britain. Diarmuid Ua Duibhne(ディルムッド・オディナ, Dirumuddo Odina? It may not display this or other websites correctly. Note it tells the story of another myth involving not Karna but instead Karna's could of been rival the god Indra. Didn't Lancer of Black using his Demonic Defender of State boost manage to fight evenly against Karna? Hassan could beat Gil the majority of the time as Grand Assassin. Press J to jump to the feed. Nov 22, 2017 #1 No prep, assumed in-character otherwise but naturally bloodlusted. Rule breaker on the other hand I have no clue. I would assume Leonardo Da Vinci's phantasm could beat him since it scans and adapts to the opponent. Karna's armor would help him survive gae bolg as just hitting you doesn't mean instant death. Karna's armor emits the radiance of the sun itself and Gawain's sword is powered by the sun(it is at it's strongest at noon, when the sun is at his highest point) so instead of reducing damage taken by Exalibur Galantine, it mere preence might actually make the sword stronger. She became king by pulling the sword Caliburn from the stone, but after it was destroyed, she was given Excaliburand Avalon by the Lady of the Lake. Let's say an A rank servant has power of 100, 1 tail Tamamo is 9 according to the materials. Problem is, Karna … Fate/Zero, Fate/hollow ataraxia, Fate/Extra, Fate/EXTELLA, Fate/Grand Order, Fate/Apocrypha, Fate/Strange Fake, The Case Files of Lord El-Melloi II, Fate/Requiem, Fate/type Redline, etc., discuss all of these and more on this subreddit! 1 Summary 2 Powers and Stats 2.1 Noble Phantasm 2.2 Class Skills 2.3 Personal Skills 3 Others Lancer is a Lancer-class Servant the protagonist can summon during the Grand Orders of Fate/Grand Order and appears as an antagonist during the Londinum Singularity. User blog:DemonGodMitchAubin/Fate Series: Karna melts the ground User blog:DemonGodMitchAubin/Fate Series: Mordred obliterates a mountain User blog:DemonGodMitchAubin/Fate Series: Spartacus Attacks Meteor But didn't Karna lose to Siegfried, who basically just a poor man's Heracles--he has the damage reduction but without the extra lives? About Tamamo each time she gains a tail, her power increases by 9 times. No an interesting thing that might work is Heracles' original Nine Lives. Fate/Apocrypha - Siegfried VS Karna [60FPS] (Bluray) - YouTube I do not own. ..You're not supposed to use Avalon like a constant shield. While he is still technically a Lancer, Jina… JavaScript is disabled. Although he was originally apprehensive to fight Rulerdue to her station in the war, he was able to go through with it after convincing himself that she would be a mighty opponent. He is a chivalrous servant who wishes to do his best to serve his Master and obtain victory within the war for the Grail. That being said, Gil could probably also pull it off with Gate of Babylon. Sasuke Uchiha vs Saber (Naruto, Fate) For sake of this prompt Jutsu = Magic but for obvious reasons Chakra =/= Mana. Sasuke Uchiha vs Saber (Naruto, Fate) Close. Saber's only bet is to some how get Karna to whiff his spear with Avalon and then excaliblast him. So if you don't have a way to bypass it directly you basically have to deal so much damage that the 90% damage reduction isn't enough, which is pretty difficult. Siegfried is known for the tales of his royalty and the way he led troops as a captain, but he was also a hero who answered the requests and calls of others. Saber is the Saber-class Servant of Kiritsugu Emiya during the Fourth Holy Grail War, and then of his son, Shirou Emiya, during the Fifth. However, upon meeting Ayaka in the Garden he realizes that his wishes had already been entrusted to the present, and … For everything related to Fate/stay night or its spin-offs. Actually, Gil should have a fair advantage here since Enkidu gets stronger the higher the enemies divinity level, correct? Round 1 - Saber Artoria vs Saber Mordred. 1 … Two possibilities may be Gae Bolg and perhaps rule breaker? Rule breaker on the other hand I have no clue. I am pretty sure Karna was stated to live on willpower since Vlad impale him from inside on the head (but correct me). The central conflict of The Mahabharata is the war over influence between the Pandava royal family and Kaurava royal family. So this got me thinking and there's probably only a handful of servants that could take him one on one. Round 5 - Caster Gilles vs Caster Shakespeare. So her power is … Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. How does this go? While this greatly reduces her offensive potential on its own, both her Intuition and her Journey of the Flowers have poor skill values to boot. Archived. Using it while he is a berserker (you would probably need a command seal to make that happen) it might unleash a long attack series of incredible heavy hits that might do the job, even if every hit only does 10% of it's normal damage. - Page 2. Saber isn't alter, so she's not going to use excalibur easily and even assuming she does, it's going to get dropped to negligible damage. Take a second to look at our. As far as i Understand it doesn't outright negate damage but reduces damage by 90%. Karna is one of the best semi-supports in the game, and he does a great job of backing up Buster teams. There is no such thing as perfect invincibility or perfect immortality in the fate universe. However in GO Karna survived a gae bolg through the chest from berserker cu but his armor wasn't active then according to the material book. Out of the presented servants, I’m not sure any get the perfect 10/10 except for a few. Ea would probably do the job but then again, Ea can kill pretty much everything.

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